Mr. HOOVER. Yes, I was. Mr. LIPSCOMB. I believe at the present time our Government is negotiating a new cultural exchange agreement with the Soviet Union. Mr. HOOVER. That is a fact. Mr. LIPSCOMB. If this is going to take place and it is insisted we need cultural exchanges, is there anything we can do to limit their operations and activities as Soviet agents? (Discussion off the record.) DOCUMENTS DESCRIBING COMMUNIST MENACE Mr. LIPSCOMB. This goes along with your question, Mr. Chairman, in regard to the group which came down here by train and picketed the White House. In October, Gus Hall, general secretary of the Communist Party of the United States, sent out a pamphlet. I received one. In this pamphlet he was talking about the need for two Germanys, coexistence, nuclear and general disarmament, and so forth. In closing he said: What is missing to bring this into full play so that Government policy can be influenced for peace is a resurgent, fully developing mass peace movement that will really reflect the deep concern of the American people. We must seek every avenue to this end. To me, it appears that he is calling for these peace movements. This was on October 2. On October 19, a nationwide peace strike was started. It was started by a woman in Washington or Chicago, I believe. Then our offices began getting loaded with mail from Women for Peace from Chicago, advocating a peace strike, and the Voice of Women in different parts of the country, advocating a program of this nature. Just this morning I received a letter from a woman who says she is confused, that everything these people say sounds good. She just does not know what to do. She said she does not know these organizations. She wants peace. I have a pamphlet here that she sent me. It was handed to her by a picket. It is from the Pacific Non-Violent Action Group in Los Angeles, Calif., and advocates such things as participation in civil disobedience demonstrations. It states, in part, "There are times when laws are used to conceal great injustice." They say "Support the turn toward peace movement. Participate in the Los Angeles Easter peace walk and rally." Some of the policies to stop tensions are: "recognition of East Germany and China although we may not agree with their methods; neutralization of West Germany as part of a neutralized central Europe with internationally guaranteed access to Berlin; social, cultural, intellectual, and economic exchange programs which will bring people with differing ideologies together and increase the awareness of human communities." We have stated before today that many people just do not know what these things are and what they represent. Often it may sound good to people who are not up on this or as knowledgeable as you are. (Off the record.) Mr. HOOVER. The great problem is the definition of "peace." We define it as we understand "peace" in our dictionaries. The Russians and their sympathizers and satellite nations have an entirely different meaning for "peace." Theirs is peace on their conditions. They add the phrase "as long as there is no opposition to communism." Some of the people who support these movements and march as pickets are thoroughly sincere in their desire for peace, but they may have been influenced by some of the Gus Hall propaganda. To me, an interesting thing is how these Communists and some of these organizations were able to twist, when Russia resumed atom testing, and then they all had to reverse themselves. Mr. LIPSCOMB. We can put out pamphlets by the millions for fallout shelters. We can put out millions of baby books. We can do all these things. Is there not some way that we can put this down for people who write to us and ask, "What can I do about communism?" in a manner and form that calls a spade a spade? It seems to me that somehow we are not getting to the people what the Communist menace is. Mr. HOOVER. Of course, much literature has been put out by committees of Congress on that subject. Mr. ROONEY. I take it you are not assuming there are a great many people in the country who subscribe to that sort of business. I think the rank and file of people in this country are sensible people. Mr. HOOVER. They are not the most vocal. Mr. ROONEY. There are a few people who are vocal. Mr. LIPSCOMB. They are the most vocal ones, but I am not assuming anything. What I do believe is that we have a lot of apathetic people in this country who do not assume one way or the other. Therefore, I believe we all ought to be knowledgeable about it and we can act better in unity as a nation. Mr. HOOVER. This morning I mentioned the document called "The Communist Party Line." I do not know how many thousands of copies the committee of the Senate has issued, although I have been told by the chairman there has been an enormous demand. This document spells out in simple language just what the Communist Party line is. The American Bar Association's board of governors, through its president, has asked us to prepare a textbook suitable for use in high schools and colleges. The seed forms there as a result of the influence of some professors who are sympathetic to the Communist movement or are so unrealistic that they are apologists for communism. When they begin to explain matters of political "isms," they do not stress the positive values of democracy. They tell you all the things that are wrong with this country and all the things that are good with Russia. There is a need, as you say, for something that will educate the people and arouse them from their apathy. Steps are being taken to meet the situation. Mr. LIPSCOMB. It may not be as black as I picture it, but I want to keep moving on it. Mr. HOOVER. There is real concern. I think that is one of the reasons you find today that some people are aroused. That is why some people join organizations to fight communism when they know very little about the organizations and probably do not accomplish as much as they would like to, such as extremist organizations of the “radical right." Mr. LIPSCOMB. I want to have a responsible approach to it. Mr. HOOVER. A responsible, penetrating, and objective approach will bring positive results. As I have said many times, it is not enough to be against communism. You must be for something. Mr. LIPSCOMB. Thank you very much, Mr. Director. Mr. HOOVER. Thank you, Mr. Congressman. I appreciate your remarks. Mr. ROONEY. Mr. Magnuson? Mr. MAGNUSON. Mr. Director, can you tell us what the situation is with respect to identifying and locating, if necessary, the officers of the Communist Party in this country who have failed to register? (Discussion off the record.) Mr. MAGNUSON. Has there been any effort on the part of the actual leaders to drop out of sight? (Off the record.) Mr. MAGNUSON. I have no more questions. Mr. ROONEY. Mr. Cederberg? Mr. CEDERBERG. Mr. Director, I only have one question. PASSPORT REGULATIONS As I understand it, the State Department recently issued a regulation in the Passport Division whereby if an individual was denied a passport for security reasons, he would have the right of confrontation to determine the basis upon which the evidence was presented so the denial could be made. Do you know anything about this? Mr. HOOVER. I have read the regulations. They pose a problem as to identifying confidential informants of the FBI. All pertinent information the FBI has is sent to the State Department and the question of making confidential informants available is determined on the merits of each case. We should not uncover a confidential informant necessary to the security of this country. The Communists would like to identify our sources. Therefore, Communists will demand to be confronted if the State Department denies a passport, and they will want to know the identity of the FBI source. Thereafter he would be of no value. Mr. CEDERBERG. That is the specific reason I raised this question and I am delighted to have the answer that you gave. I can see all kinds of problems that would be raised by the denial of a passport and the very situation you have stated could result. It would appear to me, and I discussed this with the Attorney General when he was before our committee, that there really is not much we can do about it unless we change the security statutes. Mr. HOOVER. I think the Congress by legislation could solve that problem by giving to the Secretary of State appropriate authority to deny a passport in any case where the internal security will be imperiled by disclosing FBI confidential sources of information. Communists go abroad on trips to Moscow and all over the world, and they do not do our country any good. They make speeches as Elizabeth Gurley Flynn did, portraying falsely the conditions in this country. They have to have passports. Congress has under consideration a bill to meet this very problem you raise. Mr. CEDERBERG. That is all I have. Mr. ROONEY. Mr. Director, Mr. Tolson, Mr. Mohr, I should like, on behalf of this subcommittee, to extend to you our thanks for the highly informative and interesting sessions which we have had both this morning and this afternoon. Mr. HOOVER. We appreciate that very much, Mr. Chairman, and members of the committee. WEDNESDAY, JANUARY 24, 1962. IMMIGRATION AND NATURALIZATION SERVICE SALARIES AND EXPENSES WITNESSES R. F. FARRELL, COMMISSIONER E. A. LOUGHRAN, ASSOCIATE COMMISSIONER D. FRANCIS, ASSISTANT COMMISSIONER Mr. ROONEY. Gentlemen, the next item is that for the U.S. Immigration and Naturalization Service which is to be found beginning at page 121 of the committee print. The details are to be found under tab 26 of the justifications book. At this point we shall insert pages 26-1 through 26-185 in the record. (The pages follow :) |