to unreasonable concern, responsibility, strain and danger, to which, in the interests of commerce and safety to life, they should not be subjected.

11. Under the International Rules for the Prevention of Collisions at Sea, vessels-when they can not be readily seen, such as at night, in a fog, or in thick weather-are required to make their presence known in a clear and unmistakable manner; that is, by lights, horns, bells, etc. Since a submarine has been so designed as "to see and not be seen" when operating submerged, this board is of the opinion that it would be in accordance with the principle upon which the international rules in this respect are based to require a submarine operating submerged to make its presence known in some clear and unmistakable manner, or to assume the risk in the event a collission results from its failure to do so.

The board finds that

RESPONSIBILITY

1. No responsibility and no blame is to be attached to the commanding officer, the officer of the deck, or any other person on board the Paulding.

RECOMMENDATION

1. It is recommended that no further action be taken and that Lieut. Commander J. S. Baylis, United States Coast Guard, be advised by appropriate official communication that neither he nor any person on the Paulding is held responsible for the collision between the Paulding and the S-4.

The proceedings, findings, opinions, conclusion as to responsibility, and recommendation of the foregoing board of inquiry are approved and respectfully forwarded to the honorable the Secretary of the Treasury.

F. C. BILLARD,

Rear Admiral, United States Coast Guard, Commandant.

Approved May 5, 1928.

A. W. MELLON, Secretary of the Treasury.

Senator GERRY. I would like to ask some questions as to the policy of the Navy Department in regard to the submerging operations of submarines. Which of these gentlemen will answer? Commander HOOVER. Either of us will answer your questions.

STATEMENTS OF COMMANDER J. H. HOOVER AND LIEUT. COMMANDER P. H. DUNBAR, UNITED STATES NAVY

Senator GERRY. What I would like to know is as to the policy of the Navy Department in regard to the submerging operations of submarines; whether they submerge, in the process of carrying out their exercises in preparation for a national emergency, anywhere that the ships are operating at the time, regardless of traffic, unless something unusual is in sight.

Commander HoOVER. The policy at present is that submarines submerge in the process of carrying out their exercises in preparation

for a national emergency, anywhere that the ships are operating at the time, regardless of traffic, unless something unusual is in sight. Senator GERRY. The question of submerging, then, is left entirely up to the commanding officer of the submarine?

Commander HOOVER. The commanding officer of the submarine, or his superior in charge of the submarine force.

Senator GERRY. Who would that be in the case where a submarine is cruising alone? It would then only be the commanding officer of the submarine?

Commander HOOVER. Yes.

Senator GERRY. Or might it be a superior officer-an admiral on shore at the base from which the submarine came?

Commander HOOVER. A submarine cruising alone, unless he had special orders to the contrary, would submerge whenever he so desired, to drill his crew. He would naturally pick out places where the water had sufficient depth and was sufficiently clear from obstructions.

Senator GERRY. By "obstructions" do you mean the usual navigation?

Commander HOOVER. Navigation, and crowded shipping lanes. Senator GERRY. Shipping lanes; that is what I meant.

If a submarine is maneuvering with a fleet, naturally the commanding officer of the fleet or the commanding officer of the squadron might issue instructions as to submerging?

Commander HOOVER. Yes.

Senator GERRY. But where the submarine is operating by itself, then practically the question of where it shall submerge is left to the commanding officer of the submarine?

Commander HOOVER. Yes.

Senator GERRY. There is no general instruction or regulation from the department in regard to this, except the general one of pre

caution?

Commander HOOVER. No.

Senator GERRY. And using due diligence?

Commander HOOVER. No.

Senator GERRY. What is the theory upon which the department bases this latitude in allowing submarines to submerge in any waters? Commander HOOVER. The theory is that the submarine is a selfcontained and self-governing unit, the same as any other ship, and when acting singly, can be operated entirely at the discretion of the commanding officer.

Senator GERRY. I do not think you entirely get the point that I am driving at. Naturally, allowing the submarine to submerge anywhere on the coast, and allowing the discretion to order this submerging to the officer in charge, adds to the risk of the submarine. In other words, if there were certain places with special safeguards to prevent collisions, that the submarine was directed to submerge in, the risk would be less; but there might be reasons of naval policy why the submarine did not want to pursue this policy; that is what I am trying to get at.

Commander HOOVER. In the absence of Navy Department regulations as to these so-called areas which you have mentioned, the matter of risk and advisability as to where the submarine submerges, it is naturally left to the forces afloat. They are the ones most concerned

in the risk. We have, so far as I know, no areas for submerging, except in some very minor cases. Consequently the submarines are free to operate anywhere in the ocean, the same as any other ship.

Senator GERRY. It appears that formerly there was a regulation that where a submarine was submerged, her tender should fly a certain flag; and from the testimony in the investigation made by the department, it appears that this flag has not been flown in years. What was the reason of abandoning this principle of additional safety by warning other vessels?

Commander Hoover. As I understand it, originally submarines were in a highly experimental stage, and very small, and did not engage in what we would now call tactical maneuvers or exercises. They thought they were doing enough if they went off close to the tender, and made submergence and came up. That is about all they did; and in that case the tender was in the immediate vicinity of the submarine when it submerged. Since then the submarines have grown entirely out of that stage, and are sea-going vessels; and as I said before, they take part in fleet maneuvers and exercises the same as any other ships. Consequently, it is entirely out of the question to have a surface vessel around where every submarine is operating. It would probably defeat the purpose of the maneuvers and the exercises, by indicating that the submarine was there; and also, there would never be enough surface vessels to have one near every submarine.

Senator GERRY. By "fleet maneuvers" do you mean that the submarine may be operating very far from the squadron?

Commander HOOVER. Oh, yes. It may be hundreds of miles. Senator GERRY. Do submarines operate at long distances from the fleet in carrying out naval maneuvers?

Commander HOOVER. Yes; sometimes hundreds of miles.

Senator GERRY. In carrying out these operations, it is necessary for them to submerge?

Commander HOOVER. Yes.

Senator GERRY. Do these operations have to be carried on secretly?

Commander HOOVER. Yes; that is, as far as the secrets of a game go. If they were to make known their presence, it would defeat the purpose of the exercise.

Senator GERRY. These fleet maneuvers are only carried on at certain times of the year, are they not?

Commander HOOVER. They are being carried on at all times of the year in various parts of the world. We have submarines at various places, from China to New York.

Senator GERRY. Are these manuevers generally carried on when the entire fleet is maneuvering, or are they carried on in separate units at different times?

Commander HOOVER. In both ways.

Senator GERRY. The S-4 was not carrying on any maneuvers, as I understand it. She was undergoing certain tests on a laid out course?

Commander HOOVER. Yes.

Senator GERRY. This course has been laid out for a great many years?

Commander HOOVER. About 23 years.

Senator GERRY. The S-8 was using this course, testing over it the day before?

Commander HoOVER. The previous two or three days.
Senator GERRY. How often has this course been used?

Commander HOOVER. There is testimony to the effect that it is used on the average about once every four and a half months, by different submarines.

Senator GERRY. I saw some testimony in the investigation conducted by the Treasury, to the effect that this course had been used only about 50 times in a certain number of years.

Commander HOOVER. It was brought out in the naval court that 49 official trials such as the S-4 was conducting had been held on this course by submarines in the past.

Senator GERRY. In how many years would that be?

Commander HOOVER. I am not sure, but I judged this referred to the entire life of the range, which is about 23 years. I can ascertain this later when the transcript comes to me for revision, and insert it. Senator GERRY. That would average about two trials a year. Commander HoOVER. In the old days we did not have many submarines. Now we have many more.

Senator GERRY. And in the last few years, how is it?

Commander HOOVER. There have been more.

Senator GERRY. In the last few years this course has been used more?

Commander HOOVER. Right along.

Senator GERRY. Used right along as submarine trials became necessary?

Commander HOOVER. Yes.

Senator GERRY. As a submarine course?

Commander HOOVER. Yes.

Senator GERRY. And it has been used frequently.

Commander HOOVER. For submarines, I should say frequently, considering submarines as one class of ships.

Senator GERRY. I wish you would ascertain and put into the record here how often that course has been used in the last couple of years by submarines.

Commander HOOVER. I will get that and put it in as accurately as I can. I will put it in the form of the number of days it has been used by submarines, because the same boat may have used it a number of times.

Senator GERRY. How far was this course from the shore?
Commander HOOVER. About a thousand yards.

Senator GERRY. Was not a flag flown here when a submarine was operating over this course, as a precautionary measure?

Commander HOOVER. I feel certain it was not flown from the fact that neither the commanding officer of the submarine nor the officer conducting the tests desired it. That was brought out in the testimony before the naval court, in the case of the S-8 which had been operating under exactly similar conditions the day before. The flag was not desired by the commanding officer of the S-8 nor the officer conducting the trial.

Senator GERRY. Was there any flagpole on which to fly that flag on shore as a notice to vessels there?

104672-28 -6

Commander HOOVER. There probably is a flagpole ashore at the Coast Guard life-saving station.

Senator GERRY. That is further inshore, is it not? That is 4 or 5 miles off, is it not?

Commander HOOVER. It is about 1,500 yards from the course, on shore.

Senator GERRY. There was a tender there that the flag could have been flown from, was there not?

Commander HOOVER. Yes; the tug Wandank was acting as a tender and a living place for the officer conducting the trials, and it was anchored inside the harbor at his direction.

Senator GERRY. How far was the tug from where the trial was being conducted?

Commander HOOVER. About 3 miles.

Senator GERRY. Would it have been possible for the Paulding to have seen that flag?

Commander HOOVER. I doubt it.

Senator GERRY. In other words, the tender was so far off that the flying of a flag there would have been of little value?

Coammander HOOVER. In my opinion of very little value.

Senator GERRY. The question of flying the flag was an old regulation, was it not?

Commander HOOVER. It is not a regulation. It is a form of advice intended for surface craft, provided the flag is flown.

Senator GERRY. You say a form of advice. Who has authority to order this flag flown, and who gave the order creating this flag and defining the uses of it?

Commander HOOVER. I am not sure, but I consider that this flag was probably incorporated in the list of naval flags under the direction of the Secretray of the Navy.

Senator GERRY. Is it left entirely optional with the commanding officer on either the tender or the submarine-the officer conducting the operations-to fly the flag or not?

Commander HOOVER. The practice is that it is optional. I will read you the exact wording of the paragraph which explains this flag officially on the chart. I wish to show from this that it is not obligatory to fly this flag. This chart that I have in my hand is an official publication, gotten out by the Navy Department, and is issued to all ships, naval and merchant.

Senator GERRY. For the benefit of the record will you insert the name of that chart?

Commander HOOVER. It is called the Pilot Chart of the North Atlantic, for the month of December, 1927. On this chart appears the picture of the submarine flag along with a great deal of other information which it is thought by the Navy Department might be useful to ships. Alongside of this flag is printed the following:

United States submarine warning flag. The submarine distinguishing and warning flag is hoisted on the tender or parent ship of United States submarines to indicate that submarines are operating in that vicinity. It consists of a rectangular red flag with a white center, on which is the profile of a torpedo in black. Launches accompanying submarines also fly this flag. Vessels seeing this signal should give the escorting vessel a wide berth and keep a good lookout for submarines.